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Thursday, August 25, 2011

Forget the Elitism Against Gwyneth Paltrow Martin and The Paltrow-Martin Children...

If there is ever a Jewish Elitism; the Jewish Elitism is in especially the unprovoked and opportunistic persecutions of Messianic Jews (Jewish Christians), as Nate Goldstein and Shani prove to anyone who's paying attention (perhaps including Ilana Angel):

Her kids are not not Jewish so your article is moot.




Though your article us useful to identify you as a lowly sycophant.



Comment by Dexter on 7/25/11 at 4:59 pm

Well Gwyneth Paltrow’s Jewish father probably qualifies her to be Jewish under Reform’s standards, so there’s no particular reason she can’t raise her kids in that denomination.



Comment by dee on 7/25/11 at 6:50 pm

I think it’s great that Paltrow has stated publicly that she’s raising her children in the Jewish faith. I’m not quite sure how that works, considering neither she, nor her mother, nor her husband are Jewish…but, at least she brings publicity for the countless benefits and rewards of Jewish life…I wonder why Paltrow hasn’t converted herself, considering she obviously values a Jewish upbringing above all others?



Comment by Shani on 7/25/11 at 8:24 pm

By reform standards she can raise both her kids Jewish. But I think what she is referring to is their cultural heritage and ethnicity and not their religious affinity. In any case, many people are discovering their Jewish roots and choosing to re-acquire that heritage. All the more power to them. In the long run of course, it will be up to her children and not her to ultimately decide the extent of their own Jewishness. You said, “The Jewish population is getting smaller”. Perhaps one of the main causes of this is Jews who discourage the ownership of one’s own heritage because they don’t fit their narrow elitist definition of “who’s a Jew”.



Comment by Mashiach on 7/26/11 at 7:42 am

“I’m not quite sure how that works, considering neither she, nor her mother, nor her husband are Jewish”. That’s hilarious and quite accurate. She might as well announce that she is raising her kids Eskimo. Although it would be smarter to raise them as Navajos and get them a piece of that casino income.



If you are Orthodox then being Jewish is both a religion and a nationality. If you are a Zionist it is not a religion, and if you are a Reform Jew it is not a nationality, but until now we have had no category for ‘none of the above’.



Comment by Ben Plonie on 7/26/11 at 2:42 pm

This seems kind of odd in light of her husband’s support of the Palestinians. Do a search on Chris Martin and Palestine.



Comment by Jason on 7/27/11 at 7:16 pm

I just did. Not to judge a book by its cover, but he looks like a moron. As for G.P.‘s intention; depending on your POV being Jewish has nothing to do with family, God, Israel, history, sprituality, religion, politics, self interest, self determination, ritual, practices, disciplines or a given culture. It is entirely subjective and inconsistent between individuals, and who is qualified to say which is right and what is real? This is how you get ‘rabbis’ for Palestine and all that. Today it has become a good deed for some to support Israel’s enemies and undermine Israel. These are people so removed from reality that the are not capable of considering the source of those ideas.



Comment by Ben Plonie on 7/28/11 at 7:51 pm

The Jewish people are an ethnic group first, and being Jewish comes from either one or both of the sides—ignore Kiddushin 68b, and focus on D’varim 7:1-5 for itself. In light of D’varim 7:1-5 (among other parshot), I find Gwyneth Paltrow to be a Self-Hating Jew who does no good for ‘ameinu by supporting Pleshet over Yisra’el—what is a Jewish woman doing supporting the remnant of Goliat’s people over the fellow descendants of Ya’akov?



Comment by Nicole Czarnecki on 7/31/11 at 2:43 pm

This whole thing is Bulls—t!!!! If you had a Jewish and a non-Jewish parent usually you grew up favoring one or the other!!!

Whether your mother or father was Jewish is besides the point!!! If you believe you are Jewish and claim to be then you are!!! Bill Maher’s mother was Jewish…he was raised Catholic…he never claimed to be Jewish…he is NOT Jewish!!! Paul Newman’s mother was not Jewish he chose to be Jewish…therefore he was Jewish!!!

Michael Douglas was raised ???...his mother was not Jewish…He always felt Jewish via his dad…He Is Jewish!!!



Comment by Nate Goldstein on 8/10/11 at 9:38 am

I remember when Michael Douglas MC’d an Israeli Special Anniversary on TV and said he was proud to be a Jew…later in the newspapers some crazy orthodox rabbi’s claimed he was not Jewish because of his mother…Michael was incensed claiming who were those nuts to tell him what he was or wasn’t??? Sarah Michelle Gellar & Julia Louis Dreyfus both deny being Jewish…srew ‘em…so be it!!! Michael Richards, neither parent Jewish, believes he is Jewish…says he always felt Jewish…What do we do with him???



Comment by Marty Stone on 8/10/11 at 9:50 am

To be a Jew is to be a citizen of the Israelite nation. We have a federal nation and the tribes are our states.



1) A child of two Jewish parents is a citizen of Israel and with inheritance rights in its father’s state.

2) A child of a Jewish father only is not a citizen of Israel.

3) A child of a Jewish mother only is a citizen of Israel but a citizen of no state, with no land rights.

4) A naturalized citizen (convert) is comparable to one with no Jewish father.



The law is the law and it doesn’t matter how we feel about it. The law is never going away.



Comment by Ben Plonie on 8/10/11 at 9:30 pm

Today the Indians have casinos and each Indian receives a share of the casino income. Anyone who is not a lawful Jew but insists he or she is one can try to claim to be a Cherokee and demand some of the casino income.



Comment by Ben Plonie on 8/10/11 at 9:31 pm

...More BS…More BS…if you left it up to the hypocritical orthodox Jews there would be NO Israel!!! How dare they refuse to accept someone as a Jew if they want to be one merely because their mother is a non Jew!!! We can’t afford to throw away our “Lantzmann” like that and survive. My family is secular, yet we follow all the holidays, our kids married Jews and we have been told that we are the most “Culturally Jewish” people any of our friends know!!! Let your local Chabbad fight us over whether we are Jews just because we don’t go to Temple.



Comment by Nate Goldstein on 8/10/11 at 11:20 pm

Meanwhile, a now-former friend of mine who’s a kohein (as my sister told me) thinks that Judaism is meshuga, although he loves being Jewish and supports Israel—and he’s very Far Left! As Nate Goldstein noted, “Let your local Chabbad fight us over whether we are Jews just because we don’t go to Temple.” In fact, isn’t that why many of us don’t even go to Temple or any shul of any sort? Granted that I’m a Messianic Jew, but that’s actually another thing as well—why can’t Jews believe in Jesus (Yeshua) if we can believe in Bar Kochva, Menachem Schneerson, or whoever else one could name?



Comment by Nicole Czarnecki on 8/10/11 at 11:31 pm

Hey Nicole…you lost me with…“I’m a Messianic Jew”!!! We can’t believe in jesus because he turned left while the rest of us were going right!!!



Jews for Jesus are christians…very simple!!!

Jesus was a Jew who was searching…his followers decided he was the deity!!!

In their misguided faith in their new religion the christ followers decided to “murder off” the competition…I give you the inquisition, the pogroms, the holocaust, etc.all!!!



Because of that history…switching sides, as you did, and trying to take others of us with you becomes the ultimate blasphemy and indignity towards those LOST millions of our bretheren!!!



Comment by Nate Goldstein on 8/11/11 at 10:17 am

Nate, I wasn’t here to proselytize but to give an example re your point. You sadly made your own point: “...More BS…More BS…if you left it up to the hypocritical orthodox Jews there would be NO Israel!!!” and “Let your local Chabbad fight us over whether we are Jews just because we don’t go to Temple.” You are more fit to join a haredi (“Chabad”) movement than you would like to claim.



Comment by Nicole Czarnecki on 8/11/11 at 11:08 pm

Nicole:

nah…you’re wrong…we are basicly agnostic/secularists. HOWEVER…we are very strongly Jewish culturists!!!....we won’t go to temple…but we’ve been to Israel 3 times…and support them AS MUCH AS Possible!!!...also we just about “Kvell” when we pass by the ultra orthodox with the remnents of their Russian black garb walking with their familys on Pico/Fairfax area….because they are fighting their uphill battle to preserve their faith.



BUT NOW…it’s just because of that Jewish DNA that I possess that I go crazy when I come across messianics and jews for jesus.



Comment by Nate Goldstein on 8/12/11 at 12:56 pm

“Jews” for Jesus is the title of a Christian religious organization. It’s not that we “can’t” believe in Jesus (whatever that means),it’s that there is no “Jesus” in Jewish culture, tradition, scripture,or religious practices. When you’re Jewish, temple or not, there is no worldview that encompasses any type of “salvation” because a human allowed himself to be sacrificed as some sort of political statement.



Comment by Shani on 8/12/11 at 4:35 pm

Nate and Shani, you two are proving that many Jews are way too elitist against fellow Jews. Also, I already clarified that I’m not here to proselytize. So, knock off your Anti Missionarism.



Comment by Nicole Czarnecki on 8/12/11 at 4:43 pm

Why would I “knock off” being against missionizing? In any case, you can missionize to your heart’s content,but if you think such an action is culturally,socially,politically,religiously, or traditionally Jewish, you are wrong. Missionizing or suggesting we’re “incomplete”, (as many missionaries claim), is elitist.As a Christian, you have to live with the consequences of the choice you made. You cannot expect observant Jews to understand those of you who believe in a life philosophy that encompasses the antithesis of being Jewish.



Comment by Shani on 8/14/11 at 8:59 pm

If you want to be a messianic…go be it!!!...but keep it to yourself!!!



As soon as you try to drag your fellow Jews along you’re nothing better than a turncoat/traitor who’s pissing on the graves of the multi-millions who died rather than give up their spiritual beliefs.



Comment by Nate Goldstein on 8/24/11 at 3:40 pm

Shani, I already stated that I already clarified that I’m not here to proselytize. I simply mentioned that I’m a Messianic Jew to be in full disclosure. As I said, “In fact, isn’t that why many of us don’t even go to Temple or any shul of any sort? Granted that I’m a Messianic Jew, but that’s actually another thing as well—why can’t Jews believe in Jesus (Yeshua) if we can believe in Bar Kochva, Menachem Schneerson, or whoever else one could name?”



What’s elitist is suggesting that I may not believe that Jesus (Yeshua) is the Messiah if another Jew can believe that Bar Kosiva or Menachem Schneerson is Mashiach.



Comment by Nicole Czarnecki on 8/24/11 at 3:41 pm

Nate and Shani, I wasn’t trying to drag anyone along; and I find your attitude unacceptably and intolerably elitist, as I was merely disclosing my Messianic Jewish beliefs in order to explain why I understand why many Jews do not go to shul—because of both intolerance of haredim and frankly because of intolerance such as yours.



Comment by Nickidewbear on 8/24/11 at 4:01 pm

Jews don’t “believe in” Jesus. Period. Christians, and only Christians do. There is a major difference between being fooled/hoping someone is Messiah and believing that a man who died thousands of years ago is G_d. One action is naive, the other goes against the soul.



Comment by Shani on 8/24/11 at 5:14 pm

Perhaps Ilana Angel ought to have chazak v'ematz and write "Are Jews Too Elitist To Accept Jewish Christians [or Messianic Jews, or Jews for Jesus, or followers of Jesus of Nazareth]"?